My hopes

Been pretty excited about the prospect of playing ESO and now EQNext.  I have been one of those people wondering the MMO realm for the past few years playing one for a bit and losing interest and then moving to the next.  Some I keep installed because I will come back and play every now and then, such as GW2. 

So I got to thinking the other day, why do I wonder from game to game.  Why haven't I found something that really snags my attention.  When I played SWG at launch I would stay up all night just to explore areas or work on my crafting.  I would login just to sit in the middle of our city my guild had built to hangout and talk to others while crafting or buffing. 

I also played some other MMO's that had me logging in every chance I could, EQ2, Neocron (mainly popular in Europe thank god I worked night shift). 

With these games I felt like I was part of the digital world.  I need a new sword, well time to find my sword crafting friend and buy one.  There was no looting an indestructable weapon from a mob.  Things wore out over time, they had to be repaird or replaced. 

So last night while thinking about this I realised that with most of the current games, not all of them but most, you don't have a connection to the world.  Your level 1 you must run these missions here.  Okay your level 5 you go over here now.  Crafting? Well you can do it if you want to help your alt but really not worth it otherwise.  My biggest complaint though is all the talk about "End Game"  omg what is the "End Game"  I gotta hurry and level to get to the "End Game". 

The old MMO's survived for so long because there was so much to do, EQ1 for example was still turning out expansions until recently.  Ultima Online, EQ2, EVE Online, all of these aren't so worried about "End Game".  Its about having so much to do, wanna go explore then go do it.  Want to sit around and craft things that others need, then do that.  You didn't have a mad rush to get to level cap so that you could finally join others to go play the mythical "End Game". 

I just feel like a lot of games that have come out in recent years are designed around A.D.D.  They lead you down a set path to where if you don't maximize your build from day one you might as well start over because when you get to that end game no one will want you on the team.  Most games have also pretty much alienated people who enjoyed crafting because like I said before looted weapons or crafted weapons don't permanently break.  You can just keep repairing them over and over again.

Anyways rant mode off.  I just am looking forward with hope to find that game that keeps me coming back for more. 

yep sadly gamers today all think the game starts at level cap , when for me the game starts at lvl 1 ,  I remember in EQ , it took me 6 months to get from lvl 50 to lvl 60 ,  and it was fine because there was a ton of stuff to do .

 Granted items didn`t wear out or destroy ec but crafted items were still  high in demand ,  Sadly  most of the games developed today , hold your hand while they guide you from quest hub to quest hub  telling you how and where to play to lvl the fastest on their quest level treadmill to get you to the real game the end game  yawn .

 I enjoy haveing quest to do but really,  the gamers that started playing  since 2004 would freak out if they had to  complete a quest  with no ingame map and the game not telling them where  to go and what to kill to complete it haha .  Just amazing how the more the genre progress forward  the more it progressives backwards  lol .

 Guess i like a game that offers a challenge to play then just flashy effects and hand holding game play ..

Ammo - I have the same internal feelings that you do.  

I played EQ but it was really SWG where I got my digital duchess on...I mean I couldn't be Princess Leia but I did feel that I belonged to that world.   I use to make appointments with my weapon maker so that I would know he was home.  He didn't live on my home planet where our guild had built a city and he only sold weapons in person - he was RP a shady arms dealer.  He lived off on a small corner of Naboo that was a fair trek from the shuttle port and it was an adventure every time to go see him.  He would make the exact weapon you wanted and it usually came out with better stats than expected.  His house was always full of people when he was home and we struck up some really nice conversations. 

I would wonder and explore all the planets in SWG - just to "see the sites".  They created some amazing vistas that could only be enjoyed by climbing to the tops of mountains.   I used to find lakes and ponds... deserted camps.... broken down speeders... it was awesome just to explore those worlds and I appreciated the fact they gave you a way to reach the tops of mountains even if you did have to search for it.  AND I miss that.... a lot.  I have hopes for ESO because of their expanse of ES titles over the last 2 decades.   I have some hope for the other new games coming out since I fear they will follow suit of the rest of the games over the past 10 years.  Immersion in the story and the world means a great deal to me - and others such as yourself.

Safe journ - and I hope the future brings us great adventures.

 I can really identify with all of you.  I've been an mmo'er for ..... damn let's just say my "old man " part of my name really says it all.  But the game that really sunk the hook into my cheek and got me really immersed in mmo's was WoW.  I played many many mmo's prior but WoW vanilla had me up until 3 am most nights even though I had to be to work a 7 am.  I did that for years. I have no idea how I didn't slip into some sort of coma.  Sadly after The Burning Crusade expansion to WoW I started to lose a lot of interest. I couldn't pin-point why either. At first I figured I just needed a break. Then I figured maybe I just needed another game to mix it up.  So I started mixing up my gaming. Other mmo's, different genre's, even taking six months away from gaming. Sadly I just could not rekindle my hunger for gaming.  I had very high hopes for GW2. I even set myself to pace. I wasn't going to blow through content with the same ferocity I used to attack WoW vanilla and every expansion that came a long after. Nope I wanted GW2 to last me for many years. Sadly six months later I was sitting with 5 characters all with the best equipment (except legendary items), explored every corner of Tyrias borders, had the best builds for pvp and pve memorized and had max crafting in every craft there was. 

  In my humble opinion I think I've narrowed down why games these days just cant hold my attention.  I could very well be wrong but still here it goes.  In the beginning in WoW the game had a wonderful community. You saw some one about to go down, you felt heroic helping them and they thanked you for helping them. YOU felt important to that world! You saw some one getting killed by the rival faction out in the world you helped them, even if you knew you wasn't going to win. Yes you was going to die and for some one who had never once met you before.  Yes it was going to make you have to respawn and it would take you a very long time to get back to where you was but you fought the impossible none the less. Best of all you did it with a broad smile on your face.  My reason was a simple one. "If I'm going out? I'm not doing it running away like a punk. I'm going to show these Alliance pukes how an Orc faces his end. No fear.... FOR THE HOARD!!"  To get to the point, WoW immersed you into your character fully. Even into the race you was playing.  Partly because of the community but also the story line.

 The rival factions were truly rival factions. Even out of game. I remember being at a restaurant with my son and listening to the table next to us talking about playing WoW. We struck up a conversation with them and one of the first questions asked was "You Alliance or Hoard?". They were alliance and me and my son were Hoard. For the next hour it was all about "Well yeah... that's because your a pansy Alliance!"  and " It requires strategy and thought... oh wait your Hoard never mind duurrr!!" . All in a joking manner mind you but still that tells you right there.  In and even out of the game you was your faction.  It was a real rivalry. As epic as New York Yankees and the Boston Red Sox. Only difference was you got to really kill your rival... in the game world at least.  I have never since then found another game that had me defend my faction in and out of game.  No other game set up the situation to allow me to do that.  The Hoard and the Alliance in WoW were so completely different. In appearance, in story line, even the areas that they controlled. But especially the story line. It gave you a lot of reasons to truly hate the alliance or for the alliance to hate the hoard. All of which was compounded by the constant pvp in both the regular part of the world as well as the pvp maps.  Nothing made you more motivated, then to have only one more kill to go for a quest only to have some alliance dude show up and kill your character. Making you have to respawn and travel what seemed a half hour back to where you needed to be( truthfully it was more like 5-10 minutes, but you was pissed at the time so it seemed a lot longer lol). It all had a purpose though. In fact it gave it all purpose. All the way back you was saying to your friends, "I cant wait to get to level 60 and kick these alliance (BLEEP) all over the map!!" lol.  I remember spending night after night defending the Crossroads as a level 60 Warlock. Me and about ten other Hoard against what seemed like 20 Alliance. Did it give them some strategic advantage if they managed to kill every one in town? Nope not at all.  No one even got XP from it.  You just got the pleasure of killing those damn Alliance or for the Alliance the pleasure of killing those damn Hoard.  Didn't matter if you was level 7 or level 60.  Every one there would fight till the end just for the pleasure of spilling some rival faction blood.  After The Burning Crusade that all seem to start to go away.  You ended up almost fighting along side the rival faction. The hunger to spill the rival faction blood was replaced by racing to level cap to get end game gear that came all too easy. A lot of people started playing both factions,  in order to play through the story line.   I think the day I realized that the quote "FOR THE HOARD!!" was now a punch line for a joke rather then honest pride in your faction, was the day I believe WoW started to truly die for me. 

  If you got a piece of epic gear it clearly showed on your character. I remember getting the Hood armor piece for my warlock. Just one piece of armor mind you. However when I came into Orgrimar wearing that it showed very clearly that I had braved one of the worst place imaginable with my character and not only survived but won.  Me and 40 other members of the Hoard fought for six hours and still didn't finish that raid but I came away with the best helm in game. It took another two months before I saw another character proudly wearing that hood.  Me and that guy talked for a good hour about the perils of braving Onyxias Lair.  Others complimented you, "Nice helm dude, where did you get that?" type thing.  The point here I am trying to make is that you was proud of your character. You took great pride in what you and your character had accomplished.  You wore your achievements with your character. It wasn't just "Yeah I went into Onyxias Lair, the group sucked.", It was " Yeah I went into Onyxias Lair. We didn't finish but next time we'll give em hell."  You was just so proud that even had the balls to even attempt some thing that seemed like riding a suicide rocket car into the mouth of a valcano and not only came out ready for more but came out with some thing to show for it.  End game wasn't some thing you just did. It was some thing that only a very few ever did. Because it was such an un-imaginable thing to even think about let alone accomplish. But when some one did manage that accomplishment, it showed clearly and it made you sit back and say "Watch out man that dudes got some end game armor on."  Which simply meant " Watch out that guys a bad ass and then some!" 

 Summary:

1.Hoping for some sort of true rivalry in ESO. Not seeing it so far but I'm hoping like hell. I would love to sink my teeth fully into some good reasons to get to level cap and extract some revenge.

2. Content, content, content, with a reeeeeeally hard and yet truly rewarding end game type stuff.  If after 3 months I see people walking around in a lot of end game items then I might just hang it up.

3. A great community. That takes pride in who they are and have that sense of comradery about it.  Gives you that sense that you and your character are indeed important to that world. 

4.  That the elitist of the gaming world get bored quickly and leave. 

Jenkinz: WoW wasn't as good post-vanilla for me either, and I think the reason is that guild cohesion was far less important after vanilla. During vanilla, you had to have a lot of cross-discipline work done, and you could only do that well in a guild. To fight Onyxia, or Ragnaros, you had to have high fire resistance, and to get high fire resistance you had to combine the skills of fishers, chefs, tailors, skinners, herbalists, alchemists, etc. Our guild worked for months to gather materials and craft items for each other so we could succeed together. Beginning in BC, and then more with each expansion after BC, raids were smaller, and much more emphasis was put on the individual rather than the guild. This made it easier for casual gamers and small guilds, but it removed the need for guild cohesion and coordination, which was detrimental to the community. Adding in things like cross-server LFG where people never even had to talk to one another, and gear score where grouping was determined by numbers rather than personality, just made it worse. I really miss SWG. I played a totally non-combat guy as a doctor/combat medic/politician. I ran a city and spent most of my in-game time sitting in the square of Theed talking and politicking. It occurs to me that something similar might be possible in ESO... I'll have to think about that.

I found a lot of what you talk about Oldman with EQ and with SWG.  SWG had a true "antagonist" built in and whether Empire or Rebel you made your case every day you played.   I had some great times visiting enemy player cities and being "escorted out in an orderly fashion" and told never to return if I valued my life "Rebel Scum" - "Your kind isn't welcome here"   Too bad they ruined that game with their combat revisions. 

Vanilla WOW had the same feel for me - when I went wondering too close to an some ORC well above my level and they would laugh and scoff at my lowly NE and tell me to run back to mommy before they really hurt me.  Had some wonderful experiences in the first couple of years of WOW.

Because of the extensive lore in ES, I am hoping for the same type of RP interactions and some intense rivalries between the factions.  I really think there will be a lot to explore - the world is supposedly huge.

  Had a lot of fun on Sullon Zek back in the day , used to have fun watching ole Fansy the Famous bard  make life hell for those Evil players as well ha ha .

WOOOOOOO  GO GO GOOD GUYS !    Warning some of the language  posted by the people in tells to him are not safe  for young kids .  

  http://www.notaddicted.com/fansythefamous.php

 I really wish I had played SWG. Now years later when I hear stories like yours Morigana, I can see I missed a really good game in it's day.  Same goes for EQ apparently listening to you Dirkdaring.  Well here's hoping aye? Maybe ESO will finally fill that void and give us all a ton of new stories to share five years down the road. 

I feel the same as you Oldman... My MMO days started back in the 90s with Maridian 59. UO was the first MMO that really caught my attention and then DAoC opened my eyes on how fun a RvR game can be. Nothing since those have come close to what I felt in a MMO, not even WoW but WoW would have to be the closest one to that feeling in a long while. Although with WoW there seem to be a rampant amount of jerks on there or it could be that back in the day not many people were playing MMOs and those who were knew how to treat people? Oh and btw... I played SWG for almost 4 years on Ahazi.... miss that game even though it had its faults... :(

I will probably try EQNext along side of ESO and whichever one impresses me the most is what I'll stick with. I'm hoping ESO turns out as well as they expect.... has anyone heard anything about housing or something similar? Perhaps guild housing too like we had in DAoC?