So what do you all think? I am fine with it as I am going to have a FFXIV sub but ti may mean when ESO comes out Ill drop FF.
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So what do you all think? I am fine with it as I am going to have a FFXIV sub but ti may mean when ESO comes out Ill drop FF.
Subscription Games typically have a lower population and are prone to server closures in rough economical times however the way ESO is built with 1 mega server I doubt anyone would notice them using less instances. On the plus side it allows developers to continue to grow a product without having to spend all their time with gimmicks and tchotchkes. The 2 models have pro's and con's and currently the Free-2-Play market is where the big money is at (Statistically Proven) however games that go Free-2-Play have a community that is less invested in the game and more likely to get distracted with other games. Subscription Games tend to have player loyalty, can focus all their development time on expansion of content, and the community tends to be less trolly as they actually have to pay for what their playing. It can go either way but I don't see this necessarily as a bad thing. It is however a bad thing for FFXIV in that many players will have to choose which one they really want to play.
tchotchkes
You completely lost me on this word.
Seems like its the year of resurrecting the sub: Wildstar, FFXIV, and ESO all going sub while it seems everyone else this year has gone F2P. I guess 2014 will be the year the models truly battle it out for supremacy!
Although with ESO, for me the sub puts yet another downer on the game. The videos and different information that has dropped about game play and mechanics have really brought me down from that initial high I felt about the game when info about it existing first dropped. I'm just not anywhere near as excited about ESO as I am about FFXIV and EQNext, and it seems the more info ESO drops the less I want to play it. This will certainly be a game that the beta will make or break it for me. Definitely turning into a game that I have to try before I buy.
tchotchke
Often applied to tradeshow giveaways and knicknacks you might pick up on vacation. =D
Bummer, kinda sucks since I'm currently invested in FF:XIV and my uber caual sub to EvE... not sure I'd be able to shell out another 14/month... Guess we'll have to see where things go (I've played ES for years) and more than likely drop FF & EvE if ESO turns out to be everything we've been waiting for :)
I am one of the people who loves sub games. I prefer the community, not seeing "hue hue hue", and the fact that I do not have to play bag and bank tetris, or run everywhere because mounts are a rip off. And I do not end up spending more money on buying what I need to make the game acceptable, than I would on a sub.
I am sure most players will disagree with me, but hey, subs work for me and I love them!
My Post on the Official Elder Scrolls Facebook page:
For those freaking out over the Pay-2-Play aspect of ESO let me paint you a unique picture. The reason Pay-2-Play has failed over the past 5 years is because as the economic downturn hit people could not justify spending that money over feeding their families and thus turned to free-to-play gaming to pay when they can. This in turn caused populations in many Pay-2-Play games to drop and servers to dry up. When communities disappear from servers they chain reaction into a giant snowball causing mass exile from a game much like seen with the original Age of Conan, Aion, RIFT, Star Wars, etc. Games succeed by the communities in them and when key members of that community are forced to go entire guilds and groups go with them.
Now that said, Elder Scrolls has something no other Pay-2-Play MMO has had in the past. 1 united server. There wont be server closures do to population decline. Activity wont dry up because a mega guild left your server. Everyone is in it together. Skyrim alone sold more than 10 million copies in the first 2 years. Elder Scrolls has 20 years of history behind it. Many of us have been waiting for this game for longer than most of the commenters in this thread have existed. If anyone can pull off a Pay-2-Play with flying colors Elder Scrolls can.
On the bright side, the developers can focus on making new content, adding features, and fixing critical issues, and not spend all their time making a new t-shirt for you to wear in town that you can only buy 1 week then it's gone. You also will have a community that is committed to the game and not easily distracted when the next free-2-play comes out.
Trust me when I say that I know what it's like to run a large community in a game. I've lead in pay-2-play games and i've lead in free-2-play games and I can tell you that I'd rather have a pay-2-play game to raise a community than a free-2-play. The attention is more focused on content rather than gimmicks.
I personally don't mind a pay-2-play game. as long as I have one or two free-2-play games to fall back on when I get burn out. games like FF, ESO, and RIFT (when it was) are well worth the money. but of course with the ecconomy the way it is I can only choose one. so at the moment I'll be playing FF sense it's a game near and dearest to my heart. (been playing sense the original FF on NES). I might try ESO eventually when I get a burn out on FF.
the good thing is at least these sub games don't really cost much. and it's always more cost effective to get the longer subs as they do offer discounts ^^
Sweet I was hoping they would have a sub , after playing sub based games since 1999 and gw2 being my first free to play game , I would rather pay a sub .
That is odd Fog about the sub and having to choose between spending 50 cents a day for a sub or feeding a family , I know I can`t eat on 50 cents a day.
but then The recesion thing hasn`t effected me either so i`ve never had to worry about missing a meal or spending 50 cents on a hobby , I`ve been lucky I guess .
Still Id rather spend 50 cents a day on a better overall game exp , then play free game that all the loot drops, cash, craft mats etc are artifcialy nerfed , to entice you to buy stuff from their store
tchotchke
Often applied to tradeshow giveaways and knicknacks you might pick up on vacation. =D
pronunciation?
ch(as in cheddar) small o ch(again) key(to unlock stuff)
just like its spelled. =D
Roughly choch-ka, though some go more choch-key, try to get a hint of the T's in there as well though.
It's Yiddish.
Personally I think it will be a relief just as long as they ensure that it you can get everything with the subscription. As much as I love GW2, I hate the fact that new weapon skins are only possible if I spend money on black lion chest keys, and even then it's not guaranteed. I love ANet and I'm happy to spend $10 or $20 a month on gems, but I really don't like the money grab tactics they are using for weapon and armour skins.
If ESO uses a subscription model that's great, as long as they don't pull a Trion or Blizzard and charge subscription AND force you to pay extra for vanity/weapon & armour skins.
I can see both sides, and while I certainly understand Hex's viewpoint (paying monthly means better community and not being nickel and dimed to death for basic stuff) I think it can go either way - a game like GW2 (or even LOTRO, though to be honest I haven't played that a ton) seem pretty accessible even though they are free to play. On the other hand, the short time I played Neverwinter, I always felt like there was a lot they were holding back so I'd pay.
On the other hand, if you're paying for something your expectations are higher, and the game has to provide enough to make it feel like you're getting value for your money spent. So they definitely have to provide more for us, or people will try it, decide it's not worth it, and return to wherever they came from, leaving the game a ghost town. Which is never good for communities.
Personally, it doesn't make a difference to me - if the game is engaging and fun, I don't mind paying a monthly fee for it; if it's poorly done it wouldn't have mattered if it was free to play, because I'm not going to play a game that's free just because it's there. So I guess the bottom line comes down to "we shall see!"
If don't know what tchotchke is, you need to go watch Office Space.
Right. Now.
Go.
I agree with you Hex!
Happy with a sub as long as there is no pay store.
edit: Nuts. There will be a cash shop as well. Guess I am not happy.
I was hoping for a subscription based ESO, so this is great news. The FTP format games I have played do not inspire player loyalty and the "gems" or equivalent cosmetic shinies they are constantly marketing take away from the game immersion. Let me pay my monthly fee and get out of my face! Just develop a rich world where I need my friends and hours of crafting, leveling, exploring and honing our skills to get to the dungeons Or make that just-right suit of armor.
My only other hope is that they make crafting relevant and viable in end game.
*crosses fingers*
The Pay 2 Play format is a huge turn off for me, and I would imagine anyone else on a fixed income. I cannot justify paying $x.xx dollars every month for a game that may or may not garner enough players to be interesting. I tried FFIV beta, the game is not for me, so that isn't a consideration. However having to pay $28.00 a month for two subscriptions plus an estemated $40-$60 per copy for two games (my partner and I both game) puts this game on the questionable level for me. The graphics engine is not what I would have hoped for, the movement of the characters, at least what I have seen on their website, is awful. Not very encouraging so far.
Caitlin (Caytlynne)
OH, by the way, ESO isn't a Microsoft product is it? Smile
Caitlin
Actually one of the largest reasons why recent pay-to-play games have been failing has more to do with end game content rather than economic climate. Your everyday gamer will pay for and play a game regardless of where current economic climates are. I'm not arguing that economics doesn't factor into the scenario cause it does; however recent games not so much. Recent games using this structure couldn't put out valuable content with gamers questioning, "if its worth it" Most of these recent games have pretty much failed within 6 months; and those games switched to free-to-play but by then the damage had already been done. Here lies the problem; gamers already demand quality content from their games so if you add a subscription to that gamers you better be able to back your game up with amazing content.
This is a monumental risk for Zenimax. I believe Zenimax is looking at it from this perceptive, "Hey we have a giant community following elder scrolls, lets take advantage of that and charge them." For this plan to work it has to be a "Perfect" game otherwise there going alienate their entire player-base. With all the companies that have failed to make this structure work I doubt Zenimax will be any different. I hate to say, but if they succeed I will seriously be very very surprised. You can have all the hardware and features in the world but if you don't put out content that's worth $15 a month then it will for sure fail.
I happen to agree with Vunter. MY biggest problem with gaming content lately is NOT caused by the free-2-play / pay-2-play battle either. It's a matter of whether or not the content can keep me interested long enough to keep playing - which I guess is a "Quality" issue for me not an economic one.
Too many times I've been "into" a game only to be dissapointed or bored after a few short months - as was the case with Neverwinter. Once the population dropped off, it was no longer worth my time so I just started playing Skyrim again to re-learn the history and maps in anticipation of ESO LOL! Lesson learned for me I guess - Free doesn't necessarily mean better.
For the time being I pop on GW2 now and again and try to stay current with our website here. I'm looking forward to playing with a group of friends again and almost regret trying Neverwinter all together. Of Course if a large group heads over to ESO again, I'll be happy to join all of you there - I just hope we stay there and play together for a long time. Soloing takes a ton of enjoyment out of a game for me.
I'd pay to play with stick figures if the pvp rules set is as fun as DAOC was in it's heyday.
yep stormn heh
DAOC was great in the day; but why do people dwell on the old. When I look to new games I want innovation, I want new, I want improved. I don't want a game to be the same as or as good as, I want it to better than I want new games to outshine every single aspect of the previous game I've played. If games don't innovate and strive to be new and different than really whats the point of playing.
There are a lot of elements in older games that work really well, and I agree with you, I would like games that can improve on what already exists, but it's not always possible
I bet if we took a gamer who has had a lot of MMO experience, and gave him limitless resources, he could come up with the greatest MMO ever. But, unfortunately, that's not necessarily possible, so games borrow or rehash stuff that people like, in order to make money.
I am on a fixed income and I have no issues with $14 or $15 per month for a game. I don't go to the movies... I don't eat out... I make my own coffee and as an old retired person have little or no need for fancy clothes. I still have the same furniture I retired with and before you all ask with a wry snicker on your breath - no! it's not covered in clear plastic :)
I prefer the P2P for the reasons Hex listed. I was a huge fan of The Secret World and played it until it went F2P. I was a beta tester on that game and even took out a lifetime sub - but the moment it went F2P I left.
I am pretty pleased with GW2 but I have to admit I'm not sure I would continue playing if it wasn't for the family. I love our family events and all the things we do. Running in WvWvW with our leaders is my all time favorite thing. We also have civil discussions on the forums and in guild chat. BUT - most of the content they add isn't for me. Super Fun Box - no thanks. The Clockwork invasions are actually fun but that is one of the few content additions they have done that I have actually like.
AND... I love Elder Scrolls and their history - not to mention that everything I have seen from their site and the videos hasn't let me down as it has some people - but encourages me. It looks pretty good to me for their point in development with another 7 - 8 months until release. What they charge for the game at release is not an issue - even F2P games charge to buy the initial game - and if they have what others do - then 30 days of free play to decide if you'll keep playing.
As of this moment I'm spending $25 - 40 a month on GW2 just so I can look nice. In the old days of P2P I would be grinding through content - camping elite or rare mobs - or building funds from farming mobs to get the gold to buy these items on an AH. I would actually rather camp rare spawns than spend money. I realize this is all my choice - just saying that my choice when it comes down to it - is to P2P and then camp or farm mobs - or do some fantastical quest for an uber class spear as I did for my Shaman in EQ.
Safe journ all
I don't mind the P2P, (as long as I can walk into a gamestop/retail store and buy a subscription card with cash).
My better half can never learn of the $$ I spend for computer gaming... (puts on cloak of invisibility and vanishes back into the shadows).
I'm guessing it is too early to know what payment options will be available?
Payment cards will be available
ESO /___\
should i pay you or not
aye morigane I remember camping for pally fiery avenger then epic, or with my monk camping pawbuster and chardock pipes for monk epic, and that stupid tear quest for my shammy spear of faith epic, then i did pally epic 2.0 and monk 2.0 .
but of all the mobs i camped in EQ the most brutal was ancient cyclops, along with Lord Gromrot in south karna for the Aegis of Life quest or the priest in Sol B lord nafagen lair for cleric epic ewwwww .
FRIGHT SHOUTS Tasarian !!!! pain and suffering strike you , you have taken 20k damage ....
loading please wait !
Tasarian pally Sphere of transcendence Ayonra ro EQ
Seraphone monk Circle of legends Bristlebane . EQ
Asmodess Eldritch Daocc lancerlot
Asmodess mage deathwing/Black dragon flight Wow
Asmodess sorc, Snackesize shammy Dark crag/ badlands warhammer
Dirkdaring Warrior priest , Sethiz Brightwizard Skullthrone/gorfang/badlands . warhammer .
» Edited on: 2013-09-04 18:20:39
» Edited on: 2013-09-04 18:35:37
OMG - the "Loading Please Wait" .... I shall now have nightmares again!!!
Susulemon... I think we all have time to figure out if we should pay or not - I think it Is more than 1/2 a year until release. Hopefully next spring we'll get an open beta or at least some really good videos of game play so that we can make that decision. AND - let's not forget that typically upon purchase of the game there is a 30 day free game play period which then means it's not much different than purchasing a first run console game and playing through it - gives you plenty of time to decide whether you want to subscribe or not.
Heck - Fog hasn't - nor can he from what he's stated - make a decision on whether it will be a chapter of Gaiscoch. That decision will say a lot when it happens.
The demographics of computer gamers is such that we're predominately older people with income/wealth levels that $15 isn't a big deal. I'm not a wealthy man, mind you, but I have a regular job.
The subscription isn't so much a deterrent because of the money, but it does force you to stop and think, because it's adding something to the monthly expenses. The most recent game I got for my phone was $1.99. The computer games I'm playing are F2P or buy once. Committing to play a subscription MMO at $15/mth, the length of time that I've typically played a game, we're talking hundreds of dollars spread out over time. That's ok, I average hundreds $ per year on gaming-quality computer parts, too. I'm fine with spending the money, but I AM going to stop to think, whereas the $1.99 for an android app, I don't think about.
The bigger deal in my life is whether a game is one I want to sink my teeth into, not because of the money but because of the time. If I'm going to purchase and subscribe, then I'm going to go headlong into it. It's gotta be a good game if it's gonna eat up a year + of my gaming.
"it's gonna eat up a year + of my gaming" -Mulch
I am just really hoping for a game that will eat up several years of my life. I actually want a game that will totally consume me and be my game for a long, long time. Not that I'm going to game for 10 hrs. a day - but where I can pass my time when I do game without worrying about the next update and if they will add content so I will have more to do. That I will pay a monthly fee for - gladly.
I'm happy to with a pay to play as long as they don' add the buy extra stuff too store..
I want an even playing field and when they have those kind of stores available it really make the playing uneven.
I still pay my rift per month and keep it updated just in case the guild need anything but I don't play it often. I can afford it. But now with the free to play ... I don't know I just feel wrong out spending other people while they are putting more effort into the game then I am.
As for ESO I have played all the games except the very first one and that as because I fell in low with Warcarft.
I made maps :)
I can't wait for this game to come out in the Spring!
I am looking for a new home to play that I can fell equal to others without having to open my pocket book.
I don't mind subscriptions as long as I'm getting my money's worth, but GW 2 has really set the bar high for constant content updates and fresh new things to do each month. I'm going to expect at least new content on a monthly basis, something I unfortunately haven't seen in the last few sub MMOs I played. WOW often had new content every few months, but it was always aimed at the high level hardcore types.
